Monday, October 03, 2016

TKC BREAKING AND EXCLUSIVE NEWS!!! KANSAS CITY TOY TRAIN STREETCAR BOASTS BETTER RIDERSHIP THAN SEATTLE, D.C. AND DALLAS WHILST CRITICS SKEPTICAL OF COUNTING METHODOLOGY!!!



The ridership numbers claimed by the Kansas City Streetcar are nothing less than incredible and completely surpass bigger cities which leads critics to question their validity.

Let's crunch the numbers quickly to start the week . . .

The Ride KC Streetcar website claims: The average daily ridership is 6,800.

Compare that with . . .

- Comparable in size with KC . . . The First Hill Streetcar Line in Seattle counts only 2,419 daily riders.

- In the nation's capitol, the Washington Post reports ridership with far less enthusiasm than Kansas City media: "According to the District Department of Transportation’s latest streetcar ridership report, the H Street line carried an average of 2,285 passengers each weekday in April. It carries more on Saturdays, but weekday ridership is the standard measuring stick nationwide. In raw terms, 2,285 riders per day is pretty low. But for a line that only carries passengers for 1.9 miles, it’s actually not bad."

- Kansas City can claim streetcar success hundreds of times greater than Dallas with a streetcar line that's comparable in size: "Dallas’s streetcar line opened last April and is attracting just 150 to 300 riders a day, Robert Wilonsky of the Dallas Morning News reports. The 1.6-mile streetcar connects downtown Dallas to the neighborhood of Oak Cliff. It cost $50 million, and the city hopes to expand it."

And so . . .

KANSAS CITY STREETCAR CRITICS CALL B.S. ON LOCAL NUMBERS THAT DON'T ADD UP WHEN COMPARED TO BIGGER, BETTER TOWNS!!!

An AWESOME TKC READER asks: "Is it possible they are fudging those ridership numbers?"

Only time will tell but it's a fact that OUR TKC BLOG COMMUNITY IS FIRST AND ONLY NEWS OUTLET TO PUT THE STREETCAR NUMBERS IN PERSPECTIVE and raise more questions rather than just parrot City Hall talking points.

You decide . . .

45 Comments:

Anonymous said...

Just do the math.

Those 24 million are riding the streetcar day and night.

That's the only real explanation for the discrepancy. KC has better coffee than Seattle, more power than D.C. and more money than Dallas.

We win.

No questions asked!

KC Schmuck said...

I trust whatever the Mayor and the Council tell me.

Anonymous said...

Counting "customers" for a service that's FREE.
Imagine the volume retail stores could do with a similarly thoughtful and creative marketing strategy!
And how about free trash pick-up, water service, and electricity? You know, stuff real people actually need.
The possibilities are endless.
You really can't make this stuff up!

Anonymous said...

Streetsblog USA reports that Atlanta’s streetcar carries fewer than 1,000 passengers per day.

Anonymous said...

After millions more of taxpayer money is spent on this thing they'll be disclosure that the sensors that do the automatic counting (what could go wrong) of riders was actually calibrated incorrectly and was counting riders at 4 for 1.

Anonymous said...

Salt Lake City’s streetcar was attracting a little more than 1,000 riders per day as of late last year, according to the Salt Lake Tribune.

Anonymous said...

Our KCMO bureaucrats are famous for lying about numbers. KCMO claims to have 24 million tourist visitors a year; almost twice as many as Denver.

Anonymous said...

It is way past time for an independent audit of that streetcar operation. Ridership numbers could be honestly established and there have been some reports of foolish spending of taxpayers’ dollars.

Hyperblogal said...

One Light is 97% occupied and there is a waiting list..... whoops, make that 85%.

Kansas City has 65,000 "tourists" per day. Right.

800,000 people attended the Royal's rally. Uh huh.

6,800 riders per day on the streetcars. Seeing a trend yet?

Anonymous said...

And the proof of the "inflated streetcar claim" is where, again? Up your ass perhaps?

Because you haven't proved your tired point.

And you never will.

Anonymous said...

7:54am - the proof is first-hand verification. Those streetcars are virtually empty on weekdays. Some tourist riding on the weekend can’t justify those outlandish ridership claims.

theEditor said...

Hiding the facts in beauracracy doesn't make them any less credible. City Hall is famous for hiding facts so that opponents won't ever be able to prove their position. In the real world we call it fraud but at City Hall they call it winning...against who is the question?

Anonymous said...

This City can not afford to continue to give free rides away to tourist. Once the ticket machines are installed, it will be interesting to see if the counters in the machines back up these wild claims.

Anonymous said...

Don't forget the sales projections of P&L District, it will pay for itself. Costing the city $12 million per year. Here is an idea charge for the toy train amusement ride to pay for P&L District.

Anonymous said...

Ancedotal evidence does not equal proof. Sorry.

This is "let's keep repeating a lie" bullshit.

C'mon Tony. Back up your false, born-in-bitterness claims with actual physical evidence.

But you can't and we all know it. You're a fucking sick joke.

Anonymous said...

Those numbers are from the same regime of grifters and douchebags that officially said Kansas City gets 24 million tourists a year.

The main reason your town is so run down and dangerous is an electorate schooled in a public education system that turns out only lliterates and people who can't even add and subtract with a calculator in their hands.

Anonymous said...

Exactly like the "streetcar breaks down repeatedly" claim that, as yet, is unproven as well.

http://www.tonyskansascity.com/2016/09/tkc-breaking-and-exclusive-news-kansas_3.html

Tony got ripped pretty good on that one over his falsehoods.

Anonymous said...

The streetcar riders are simply tourists who cannot find a hotel room. When we add 800 subsidized rooms to the downtown inventory, ridership will level off and the line to ride the choo choo will once again only stretch as far as Wichita. Or Coffeyville.

Anonymous said...

Let's just accept everything Tony says without any evidence whatsoever, it's much more convenient.

We'll look super smart and AWESOME that way.

Anonymous said...

So, the news reports about the streetcar is a falsehood too? Grow up, Johnson. Millennials are overrated.

Anonymous said...

"If you like your doctor, you can keep your doctor"...
"I did not have sex with that woman..."

Uh, yeah, let's accept those "free ride numbers".

Anonymous said...

KC Streetcar = 6,800 daily riders
Seattle = 2,419 daily riders
Washington DC = 2,285 daily riders
Dallas = 300 daily riders
Atlanta = 1,000 daily riders
Salt Lake City = 1,000 daily riders

Outlandish claims of the KC Streetcar folks are insulting the intelligence of the citizens of KCMO!

Anonymous said...

If City were charging those tourists $5 per ride, it would go a long way toward reducing our water bills.

Anonymous said...

Tsk tsk. Touched a nerve. Look, the burden of proof is on the City here. If you hadn't ruined your credibility with goofy numbers and rationale for everything, we might actually trust you. :)

Anonymous said...

So scared of a little accountability. I wonder why.

Crazy Clown said...

Hey Mayor SLY Cockroach James,,,,, YOU and your ilk are Full of utter Shit, you scumbag Communist Bastard !!!!!

Anonymous said...

Look, the burden of proof is on the City here.

And they have proved it to everyone's satisfaction except a few weirdos.

i.e., you guys.

Nuts ahoy!

Anonymous said...

The 6,800 figure is statistically impossible. To even get close to that number would require ridership of people taking the streetcar to and from work. There are not that many employers in the area from Union Station to City Market that would have employees living along the streetcar taking it to and from work. Most of the employees downtown probably live outside the city or in areas nowhere near the streetcar and take the bus or drive their cars to work.

Anonymous said...

1:40: A little touchy today aren't we, trolley boy. If you pick ridiculous numbers you'd better be prepared for some skepticism. Toot toot. Clunk.

Anonymous said...

Identifying Faulty Reasoning

A reasonable conclusion (such as the validity of ridership counts) is based on data or evidence. Faulty reasoning occurs when the conclusion is not supported by the data. Three common types of faulty reasoning are (and read the third one closely):

• Overgeneralization, or drawing a conclusion based on too little data. In overgeneralization, information about a limited number of situations or things is applied to a broad class. If a conclusion about a whole class of things is based on very few samples, be alert for overgeneralization. One way to test for overgeneralization is to obtain more data. Do additional samples still fit the conclusion?

An example of an overgeneralization is, “American Beauty rosebushes cannot survive long harsh winters, because in my garden two American Beauty rosesbushes died over a long harsh winter.” This is an overgeneralization based on two rosebushes.

• Illogical conclusion, or making an inference that is not supported by data.

Illogical conclusions often indicate a cause-and-effect relationship that does not exist, based on coincidental events. To test for an illogical conclusion, ask how the initial information is linked to the final conclusion. Are there any facts that support the link?

For example, suppose you never see people on the streetcar. You conclude that “The numbers are all lies.” This is an illogical conclusion based on two unrelated incidents.

• Personal bias, or basing conclusions on opinion rather than information. Personal bias can lead to conclusions that are actually contradicted by the data.

To test for personal bias, determine whether the author or speaker is trying to argue for a particular point of view (yes). Is the point of view supported by facts or only by opinions? If no facts support the argument, then bias is likely.

For example, the speaker says, "The streetcar numbers are fudged.” The speaker gives no evidence and shows personal bias against the facts.

When you detect faulty reasoning, you need to obtain additional information to determine whether the conclusion is valid or not.

Anonymous said...

To put it in perspective if the streetcar runs for 18 hours a day at 10 minute frquencies that is 108 trains per direction per day that means if traffic is relatively balanced there would be an average of 34 people using the train on every trip. This is not to say there would be 34 people on the train at any point because people rarely use transit routes end to end. Obviously that also means if some trains are running nearly empty others need to be very full. I don't know the streetcar do those numbers reflect what people are seeing?

Anonymous said...

2:56, you are drawing an illogical conclusion, or making an inference that is not supported by data.

Anonymous said...

When the streetcar was in the planning stage, I am sure Russ Johnson said it was not about moving people, but rather it would bring businesses and jobs to the area. Why are we talking about the number of riders? Shouldn’t the trolley folks be telling us about all the new business and jobs the streetcar has brought to the transportation district?

Anonymous said...

And the most important aspect of all this back and forth is
WHO REALLY CARES?
Arguing over the ridership of a 2.2 mile long FREE streetcar just goes to show what a one-horse hick town KCMO really is.
Gaga over an electricity -driven tracked vehicle!
Wow!
Mooooo!

Bob said...

2:31, your post is dressed up as logic 101, but really you make only two points: there is no proof that the streetcar numbers are fudged, and anyone who says the numbers are fudged without proof is biased. OK, so far so good. But, while no one has offered empirical evidence that the numbers are fudged, one can suspect that they are, based on personal observations of a nearly empty streetcar at various times during the day, and/or the per se improbability of a very large number. Both seem to be present in this case. In addition, if the ridership figures are put together and made public by people who have a vested interest in streetcar success, that is another reason to be skeptical.

When I read the story claiming more riders in KC than in other cities, I wondered whether those cities charge a fare to ride their streetcars, and also whethre they count ridership in the same way that is done in KC. If either condition exists, then the comparison is inapt. I don't know the answer to either question, and I am not going to research it.

The city administration can clear this up quickly by submitting to an independent audit of its rider counting methods. I doubt that will happen.

Anonymous said...

2:31 -- We've seen what can happen with manipulated numbers at Wells Fargo, Volkswagen, and Madoff's ponzi ploy.

So, your last line:
"When you detect faulty reasoning, you need to obtain additional information to determine whether the conclusion is valid or not".

Hmmm, is that a hint surveillance is invited to certify rider data?

Anonymous said...

When you try and claim ridership that is almost three times larger than any similar streetcar line in the US, there is more than suspicion that the trolley people are lying. There must be some serious flaws in how they estimate ridership.

BKS guy said...

I saw both street cars last night. It was 7:30 one car had 17 people on it and the other had 10. Did see two people waiting to get at one stop. 6,800 I don't think so. I say charge the riders and then make the official count.

Anonymous said...

Sure, discount the criticism. No one will ever check your figures, because no one ever does that. ;)

Anonymous said...

There has been no explanation why the trolley ride is free for the tourist. Would it make more sense to charge them and let our residents ride the buses for free???

Anonymous said...

4:18 pm – right on target. The ticket machines will have accurate counters and then the citizens of KCMO can make a decision if the streetcar program should be continued or terminated.

Anonymous said...

5:36 +1

Crazy Clown said...

FACT :

I was at the Street Car on a Sunday Morning at 6am, and I literally counted over 300 MILLION people waiting to ride that TOY TRAIN at 6am on a Sunday morning !!!

They came from as far away as , Planets PLUTO, VENUS, SATURN, and Jupitor and Mars too !!!

Then suddenly within an instant - I was awakened by my DOG wanting out to take a PISS on the front lawn, and I realized, it was all just a BADD Nightmare !!!!!!!

Anonymous said...

If no facts support the argument, then bias is likely.

oh hello

Anonymous said...

You all need to wake up. The KC Toot Toot is doing better than the downtown line in New York City. That is because we are a major league city.